I don't know if this has been posted before, but Rosy, this is a great positive video about Penasco- (Russ and Naomi you look like you're having fun as well). I heard it was packed again this weekend (at least at Flavios)! The second video is Rosy and Russ' radio show- Rocky Point Ramblings. Looks and sounds like you're having fun.
It is very ver packed again this weekend Maya is reporting 100% and it is looking full all along Sandy Beach and there are a lot of quads running around in the desert. A lot of families here its very good.
Occupancy rates have nothing to do with anything anymore. I got into an heated discussion with someone on the forum about domestic tourism and the lack of money spent by that kind of tourism. Well... its seems that its a mix of domestic tourism and POCHO tourism now! All I kept hearing before July 4th weekend was that OCCUPANCY WAS VERY HIGH and that apprx. 35,000 visitors were expected. That seems promising until you realize its all pochos from El Centro, Calexico, The Inland Empire, San Diego, and Texas. Rocky Point is being overrun by pocho tourism. Yea occupancy rates might be high but these people arent spending money elsewhere. This was exactly one of my points in a previous discussion about spring break vs. semana santa. The conversation mainly centered around the Malecon not being ready for Spring Break but it was going to be ready for Semana Santa. Someone was reassuring me that it wasnt really that important because domestic tourism and Semana Santa bring in so much money to the city. Well... someone that I wont mention that happens to work in A VERY POPULAR ESTABLISHMENT IN THE MALECON told me that YES there was a lot of people for Semana Santa and NO they didnt spend any money abroad! Going back to July 4th, yes it seemed town was rather full. I saw a record number of California plates and a few Texas as well, however every night we went out, no Americans. Pochos are Americans but they dont go out and spend money. They sleep 10 people in a 3 bed/ 3 bath condo and drink endless coolers of Budlight purchased in America, eat food they bring. Occupancy rates mean nothing to me anymore and its not a selling point on how well business is doing in RP. If it was an accurate measurement of success of business then why is Manny's closing, baja, nobody at Pink Caddy. Elixr is down to one night a week now, and Gua Guas might be the only place to grab a drink after midnight besides Wrecked at the Reef. I personally witnessed the ghost town effect during the night in RP over the JUly 4th weekend and I have vivid memories of the hay day so nobody is going to try and sell me a bs story about how RP is busy or crowded on some off weekend in July, SORRY NOT GOING TO HAPPEN. Yea there might be people in the hotels and resorts but its a far cry from where RP used to be and IM SURE WHERE business owners of RP WANT TO BE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I remember about 3 years ago (maybe less)....when the swine flu hit. Friends owned a bar on the Mirador....I spent a lot of time in the evenings there with my daughter....late Firday/Sat. nights, you could not move on the Mirador...it was wall to wall parked cars and people walking in the street....but....there was almost no one in the bars....everyone brought their own "drinks"....and they were drinking in the streets out of their vehicles.....the only time they came into the bar was to use the restroom.....so...was the traffic/"occupancy" on the the Mirador an indication of the business my friends had? Hell no! BTW, they are no longer in business in Penasco!
And the sleeping 10 in a 3BR condo....I posted somethning along that vein on here ....and someone from Las Palomas (of all places) came on here and said....OH NO...that doesn't happen there!:ostrich::rofl:
Even if that's true with those people not spending $ in town (which didn't sound true because someone in my family said Flavios was packed during the week), you still need cleaning people, gardeners, Banana boat operators, ATV rentals, etc. We visited the Mayan last weekend, and like I said it was PACKED with people. Probably many of them won't go to town, but the Mayan definitely needed workers to support these people, and I would guess that's true at the Sandy Beach resorts. The restaurant at the Mayan was full, and the cook at the Shrimp Bar was extremely busy- I asked him where he was originally from and he said Penasco. I took pictures of the Grand Mayan being built (I'll try to post later), and yes, they are still working on that complex, with many workers, as well as Mayan Lakes and Central Park. Every day, I see the buses of workers coming from Penasco out to the Mayan for work. So people who live in town are benefiting, it just may be a different mix. We went to Thrifty Ice Cream in Old Port across from the church and Combo Taco (I agree not high end), and it was full with Americans and Mexicans. Someone recently posted a video of the IceBar , and it and it was crowded- don't know if it was all people from Penasco or visitors, but obviously they're benefiting, as well as the beer distributors, Coke bottling facility, etc. Read reviews for restaurants on Trip Advisor. Yes, right at the top is a State Department Travel Advisory (which probably is scaring out of state people), but there are people from outside of Arizona visiting restaurants. Slowly, as people get comfortable coming to Penasco, they'll get outside of their shells, and hopefully we'll all be pushing each other at the Malecon for tacky T-shirts or jewelry. Until then, I believe the people of Penasco and the town itself are benefiting from 100% occupancy.
Miramar, good post. OK so the visitors here now filling the rooms aren't spending a ton of money eating out or drinking expensive beers but they are coming and they are spending money. I dont like nor do I agree with the "way it used to be is the touchstone" It is what it is now! It is better than it was last year for sure. I dont feel we need the "all or nothing" theory. The businesses that adapt to the way it is now will survive. Manny's is not closing, instead it is thriving, not on NOB drinkers but with boxing and other events that draws shall I say "local pesos"? Money is money, business is business. When the economy in the USA gets better............then they stop bashing Mexico..........then people will stray a bit further from their comfort zone.....then we will see more NOB drinkers here. Slow and long and patient process it took 40 years for Rocky Point to be crowded and overbuilt it took 1 year to crash and burn and it will take decades for it to get back there again, enjoy the ride.
Whether it's good or bad for the economy I don't think was the point of Mexico Joe's post.....the way I read it, there is a lot of "rah rah" going on based on high occupancy rates at the hotels and condos. It just does not translate sufficiently to improvement in the economy in Penasco, for the people of Penasco, based on the type of customers and how they spend their money. JJ's has closed a couple of days a week.....unheard of! Balboa's Restaurant has closed. Everytime I've gone by the CamelToe (yeah, i know that it has a different name)...I haven't seen anyone in there. As for Mannys and the customers packing the place....you don't make any money on a few beers, and that's the type of business that you get from that type of customer. The titty bars have closed...because the "locals", or other Mexican customers buy one beer, and sit there for an hour nursing it. No profit....(and I won't even address the business the girls DON'T get in the back rooms...of which the establishment takes a cut)! Another establishment I know of on the Malecon has closed for an entire month. The people that have increased the occupancy rates are bringing in the food and drinks from either the states, or are buying at the distributors for the beers or markets for the food. Those places have not increased their staff. Where is the trickle down from that? How many of the condos have increased their staff, including the cleaning crews, with this increased occupancy? I'm going to go out on a limb here and say that they are working the existing staff a lot harder! As for the Mayan, someone I know recently lost her job out there. Yeah...the visitors are renting atv's...but other then the $$ spent on gas...and the few people employed renting them out...where is that money going? You can't tell me that the vendors running the atv's are also the owners! We all know what some of those units run....and I'm seeing many brand spanking new units lined up for rental.....many are in the $15K USD per.....and I can just imagine what they run in Mexico!
When you have an economy based on tourism....the true trickle down effect comes when you have people spending $$ in the bars and restaurants.....and the workers there actually making some real money...which they then spend locally. Not from the salaries of the maids, gardeners, etc. at the condos....especially when they don't hire more people. There is no real trickle down from the beer distributorships or the the Super Lye/Bodegas.
So please.....stop with the "rah rah" stuff....yes, more people are coming down to Penasco....but it has a long way to go to get back to a viable economy! I really hope it does!
BTW....what happened to the shopping mall over by the harbor....they were going around the clock with construction...but from the last couple of times I've been down recently...it looks like it's come to a screeching halt!
Pretty sure a national with a family not going to run down to a bar when he get down or up to penasco! Most families will spend the day at the beach, spend their
money on what they can afford, They will cook their own food and have a good time mixing things up getting the whole family together.
A pocho is a mexican-american that speaks very little or broken spanish, discolored, what they call in the usa a coconut.
Joe i don't think u ever been to guau guau's, u can't even spell the name right!
Pretty sure a national with a family not going to run down to a bar when he get down or up to penasco! Most families will spend the day at the beach, spend their
money on what they can afford, They will cook their own food and have a good time mixing things up getting the whole family together.
A pocho is a mexican-american that speaks very little or broken spanish, discolored, what they call in the usa a coconut.
Joe i don't think u ever been to guau guau's, u can't even spell the name right!
Thumbs up Miramar Thumbs down Joe's
Playa...I don't know which "Joe" you were responding to...but you always try to make things "personal" on here....you just love pissing contests!
From reading many of your posts on here....I would not comment on anybody else's spelling (or grammar)! Actually, after you came back from your recent "time out", I was wondering what you were smoking or drinking!
OK, Manny's has closed temporarily, but like I said Flavios was packed. Manny's was dependent on the trailers and Spring Break, and since the trailer parks closed up, it's been hard for them. I wish they would open the Tequila Factory at Manny's in the Mirador- you would get a two fer: the view of the ocean w/ tasting tequila. Now that restaurants and bars have opened along Sandy Beach, I think people feel more comfortable traveling less, using Sandy Beach restaurants and bars, and staying close to their condos. But my point was even in the "heyday", the town was empty during July and August, and now some places are full.
Like I said in a previous post, about 90% of the cars in the Mayan lot (which was overflowing) were from California, and from talking to several of the people, some are now using the Coastal Highway and telling their friends it's only 4.5 hours from San Diego (according to one person I spoke to). Here's a review from a few weeks ago (yes, I picked this one out from several to make a point that people staying at the Mayan are going to town, eating, shopping, and taking cruises). Even if they're just staying at the resort, it requires workers to support that level of activity. Even if it's just one person, word will get around, and hopefully things will (are) improve (improving).
"This was our third stay at the Mayan Palace Puerto Penasco (now called Mayan Palace La Jolla de Cortes) and our family loved it as much this third time as we did during our first two trips.
One of the things we like best is that the resort is within easy driving distance of our home in Los Angeles. Its close proximity allows us to take our family of four on a fancy vacation without incurring high airfare costs. WE LOVE THAT! The drive is about an hour from the Arizona border and the roads are all well-marked, paved, and -- most importantly! -- safe.
As for the Mayan Palace itself, the facilities are clean and top-notch. The staff is helpful and courteous, and the wide-open beach is just gorgeous.
The resort has two pools--one luxurious outdoor pool, and one beautiful indoor pool (which is perfect for hot summer days or cool winter eves). There are two lighted tennis courts, a Jack Nicklaus signature golf course, a state-of-the art Spa, a game room, Internet room, and two terrific onsite restaurants both of which are very reasonably priced for a resort.
On a couple of occasions, we ordered room service which was surprisingly good and inexpensive. We also went into town one day for some authentic Mexican "flavor" and a sunset cruise."
Miramar....look at the last line of your post. I know a couple people who own at the Mayan (timeshare)...and when they get there, they hunker down at the resort, and maybe leave once to go into town during their entire stay. That doesn't d anything for the economy of Penasco.....
BTW....something I didn't mention in the previous post....tipping by Mexicans versus gringos....do mexicans even understand the concept of tipping? And I won't even go there with the "pochos" mentioned by someone else. The people working in the restaurants and bars depend on tips for a living.....and even if the Mexicans or "pochos" come in....they don't tip!
Yes....the closing of the rv parks hurt Manny's...and the opening of all the other places along Sandy Beach. Putting the Tequila Factory on the beach would probably kill that too....it would be out of sight...out of mind! I like being able to do some tequila tasting in an airconditioned place during the warmer months....don't recall if Manny's Cantina has air in any of the indoor places.
My point is the Mayan (and most other places in town) used to be DEAD in July/August (even back in 2004-2007), and now it (Mayan) is full. People who stay there may/may not go into town every day, but some do go into town, which benefits places like Flavios. It also takes workers at the resort who get paid. I see the buses going from town to the Mayan full of workers many times during the day and night. I realize things aren't as hopping as they used to be, but places are MUCH busier than they were last year, and busier for July and August even during the "heyday". I wish I could post the pictures of the Grand Mayan being built- Daniel Chavez is plugging away at that, along with a condo that he just completed to the west of the Mayan. People are working on those projects, and when complete they are going to need employees, which benefits Penasco. As for Porto Mio, I drove past it in the beginning of June, and there were people working on it- not many, but I did see progress. It seems that is being completed on a Mexican schedule!
You meant to say Manny's has closed temporarily in the PAST, right? As in, over the recent winter, but is still open on most days since they reopened in March of this year?
IAnd the sleeping 10 in a 3BR condo....I posted somethning along that vein on here ....and someone from Las Palomas (of all places) came on here and said....OH NO...that doesn't happen there!:ostrich::rofl:
That was me you are referring to. And no, I didn't say it didn't happen, I said you CAN sleep 10 in a 3br condo. Each condo - regardless of the development (Sonorans, Las Palomas, Princessa, etc.) has it's occupany limits. Why can't you sleep 10 in a 3br condo? If I had a big family I'd do the same thing!
I also think it's unneccessary to call people "pochos". Technically a "pocho" is a term that means Mexican Americans who lack fluency in Spanish. From what I've seen, most of the Mexican Americans who were down in RP over the 4th did speak Spanish. I saw lots of them speaking Spanish not only to beach vendors, but to each other.
I don't think anybody is saying that RP is back to where it was in its heyday, but things are getting better.
No Rah rah here Joe, just saying its better now than last year and it will take a long time to eat up the capacity which came with the boom. Penasco has too many restaurants and clubs for the size crowd it is currently drawing. I cannot accept your attitude that its all bad because the bars aren't busy, that is not a true indicator except for the bar owners. I live here all the time, and I drink, but I don't go do the bar circuit everyday, that doesn't mean I am not spending money because I am. This is a period of restructuring to a new economy. This thing is not going to be over anytime soon. Adapt is the word of the day. I think its fine that JJ's is closed 2 days a week, it makes financial sense right now. I will say that I have never been as busy as I am right now in the tour business and other enterprises that certainly do have a trickle down effect.
You meant to say Manny's has closed temporarily in the PAST, right? As in, over the recent winter, but is still open on most days since they reopened in March of this year?
Manny's is open and he is spending money on promotions so I am not sure what the other comment was about
That was me you are referring to. And no, I didn't say it didn't happen, I said you CAN sleep 10 in a 3br condo. Each condo - regardless of the development (Sonorans, Las Palomas, Princessa, etc.) has it's occupany limits. Why can't you sleep 10 in a 3br condo? If I had a big family I'd do the same thing!
I also think it's unneccessary to call people "pochos". Technically a "pocho" is a term that means Mexican Americans who lack fluency in Spanish. From what I've seen, most of the Mexican Americans who were down in RP over the 4th did speak Spanish. I saw lots of them speaking Spanish not only to beach vendors, but to each other.
I don't think anybody is saying that RP is back to where it was in its heyday, but things are getting better.
I'm not the one who brought up the term pocho.....
I've seen 8-10 (or more) people staying in 2 BR condos (not Palomas, since I have never stayed there).....but I also wouldn't want to spend a vacation with that many people in the same condo...even if it's permitted.....
Maybe it's getting better with the number of visitors....but I don't know if it's getting better economically...and the money being spent in town for goods and services (other than lodging and atv rentals)!
This is a tourist town. The town needs tourist to survive. Easy enough to understand. When we have sell out weekends it means that we actually have tourist. Some tourist like what they experience here enough that they become buyers. Maybe they just came here the first time because of a special rate on a room or whatever, but they are here. I believe we will see units sold because of this activity at some point in the future. I believe we will see some inflow of migration as well which is a good thing. It gets back to the organic nature of growth that Penasco enjoyed for decades, not the hyper inflated rah rah that we have seen in the recent past.
I've seen 8-10 (or more) people staying in 2 BR condos (not Palomas, since I have never stayed there).....but I also wouldn't want to spend a vacation with that many people in the same condo...even if it's permitted.....
Maybe it's getting better with the number of visitors....but I don't know if it's getting better economically...and the money being spent in town for goods and services (other than lodging and atv rentals)!
I highly doubt that there are people in the nicer condos on Sandy Beach over the occupancy limits. Most resorts have security that are very diligent about making sure people are wearing bracelets. How do you sneak people in without the bracelets? Maybe they do that at the lower end condos like Pinacate, etc.
Even if it was allowed, just because you personally don't want to spend a vacation in a condo with that many people doesn't mean other people don't have a choice. I'd rather be cramped in a condo with family during the evening while I'm sleeping so that we could split costs and enjoy the beach rather than no vacation at all.
What about word of mouth? Every time someone hears that one of their friends or family has gone to RP and had no problems with violence, etc., enjoyed themselves and can't wait to go back gives other people the confidence to go themselves. It's all good for the economy.
OK....we can go around and around on the topic....but increased occupancy rates do not make an economic turnaround....it's going to take time!
mis2810...I saw the 8-10 in a 2 BR in one of the "nicer condos on Sandy Beach" (and I have been at Las Palomas...one of my friends owns/lives there full time.....and there are resorts that may have a bracelet/wrist band rule....but don't enforce it very well, especially when the security/attendants are too busy making sure that "other stuff" isn't going on....like little kids aren't in the pools/hot tubs unattended....etc....especially when the condos are at 100% occupancy (rental pool).
"OK....we can go around and around on the topic....but increased occupancy rates do not make an economic turnaround....it's going to take time!"
nuff said
“Occupancy rates have nothing to do with anything anymore.” What????? That may apply to some business but for those of us who have investments in property or those that provide services to those investments the occupancy rates are everything to us. We buy, sell, upgrade and change our rates based on that information. Yes I’m damn happy to see them here and I don’t care where they are from or how cheap they appear. I hope they had a great time and come back with their friends. BTW over 25 years ago when I started to come to RP with family and friends we also did not have much money so we brought food, cooked at the camp site and really did not spend much money in town. Our business was appreciated even though we did not spend a lot because anything was better than nothing. What happened? Greed? When times were busier it spoiled too many people’s way of thinking and now they base everything on that time. We should appreciate every person who visits no matter where they stay or what they spend their money on.
“Occupancy rates have nothing to do with anything anymore.” What????? That may apply to some business but for those of us who have investments in property or those that provide services to those investments the occupancy rates are everything to us. We buy, sell, upgrade and change our rates based on that information. Yes I’m damn happy to see them here and I don’t care where they are from or how cheap they appear. I hope they had a great time and come back with their friends. BTW over 25 years ago when I started to come to RP with family and friends we also did not have much money so we brought food, cooked at the camp site and really did not spend much money in town. Our business was appreciated even though we did not spend a lot because anything was better than nothing. What happened? Greed? When times were busier it spoiled too many people’s way of thinking and now they base everything on that time. We should appreciate every person who visits no matter where they stay or what they spend their money on.
Very nice post! I could not agree more and I am with you! (handshake)
I'm with Az Dan. 36 years ago, I was a broke college student. We brought food from the states, buying only tortillas, bolillos, Pacifico, Ron Bacardi Anejo and Mexican bottled cokes. We went out for 2 meals, usually and spent a fair amount of time in the bars.....i always felt appreciated but I speak Spanish......
I mean, talk about a disconnect! Jesus, i feel like there is way too much crotch grabbing going on here and thats my polite way of saying it so I dont get sent to time out again. Anytime I see a post from Miramar or Russ the same 5 people are holding each others crotches, slappin high fives and what not. Haha, so disturbing. Russ could be completely wrong about something and the same five people would still click the THANKS Button! Im want to be clear and concise so I apologize because the thread blew up so fast there was a lot to read and comment on. First of all if I hear another Rocky Point is so busy, FLAVIOS was packed Im going to puke. I wouldnt eat at FLAVIOS if one of the guys that I almost hit every time driving through the malecon payed me! Kidding me?! You're trying to sell me on how busy town was WITH FLAVIOS???? THATS A BIG LAWLIGATOR. Flavios isnt a barometer of success! In regards to the town being full in July, I cant speak to the whole month but I can speak about the 4th in particular. There used to be WEEKENDS in Rocky Point that were a guarantee: Spring Break, Memorial, Fourth of July and Labor Day. When Im in RP now on these weekends the MIRADOR street looks like a COMPLETE GHOST TOWN and Im not even talking about the locals that used to park there and drink all night. Im talking on the fact that there were 50 people coming in or out of Mannys every 5 mintues, 100 people in the street walking to their next destination, pink caddy full, everything full. Taco stands on every corner. I mean honestly that street is so dead now its a joke. The lights are out and it is dreary. This fourth of july weekend i was personally at wrecked 3 different nights with no more than 100 people in the bar. Thats fourth of july weekend now, one bar and its got 78 people. You cant sit here and tell me its busy, Im sorry. The people that own property and are able to rent right now, yea they're at least getting a slight return of something right now but it doesnt directly correlate to more money for the town. I along with JOE know an establishment in the MALECON that is closed FOR THE ENTIRE MONTH PRACTICALLY OF AUGUST. If there was money to be MADE the BAR WOULD BE OPEN, BOTTOM LINE. We're talking not even open on the weekends and when I heard it from MR ED I did a double take, shook my head and had to ask him if I was hearing MR ED correctly! Even WEEKENDS! I mean seriously you cant comment in a post and be SELLING ROCKY POINT WITH COME DOWN EVERYTHINGS GREAT FLAVIOS IS PACKED HAHAHAHA! Pochos dont spend money, you know who spends money? The 20-35 demographic who has to have all the latest phones, devices of all kinds, audio, flat screens, my wheels are better than yours, well my C class is better than yours, seriously these people and Im one of them have the DEEPEST pockets in AMERICA! This is the demographic thats spends money aimlessly for fun. When you try to spin it Russ it just sounds like you're in denial of the truth. The truth that businesses are hurting hard because the DEMOGRAPHIC of RP has changed. Ill have to wrap this up because I could go on forever but yes on more than a BILLION occasions Ive seen 13 people in a 2 bed, and if you dont think it happens you're in denial. To my understanding, you can purchase additional wrist bands for an additional 5$ per day per person. So you could have 16 people in a 3 bed doesnt matter you just pay the extra fee for wrist bands. Im delusional now hopefully thats everything.
PS I want to see RP prosper and do well. Im not a RP hater by any means. I just think we have a difference of opinion on what busy is. When I refer to busy, Im referring to social life. If there are people there but they dont go out because its not my demographic and theres nobody in town at night and everything closed SOCIALLY speaking than the town isnt busy in my opinion.
PS I want to see RP prosper and do well. Im not a RP hater by any means. I just think we have a difference of opinion on what busy is. When I refer to busy, Im referring to social life. If there are people there but they dont go out because its not my demographic and theres nobody in town at night and everything closed SOCIALLY speaking than the town isnt busy in my opinion.
Damn....I'm gonna hate myself in the morning...but I have to agree with Mexico Joe on this whole issue....and those of you who know me, know that I care about what happens to Penasco...and the people.....
Az-Dan made a point about the condos....yes, the occupancy is good for the owners....they've also been hurting big time for a while....but that still does not translate to being a big help to the overall economy of the town. Does any of the tax collected on the rentals go to the city? Having satisfied customers means that they will come back, or recommend the place to their friends. However, unless the demographic changes of the people coming down...and you start seeing the gringos (or wealthy Mexicans) who eat out most of their meals, and drink more than a few beers...it will still not translate to a big economic gain for the town's people....
OK Mex Joe, I remember a time going to Old Port in July and August AND Labor Day weekend in the 90's and we were the only people there- we felt like VIP at the restaurants. I remember going to Mayan about 5 years ago in July/August and Labor Day and NO ONE was there. Prior to about 2004, July, August and September were dead in the town- you may be remembering 2004 and beyond where 4th of July was busy, so maybe the condos changed things and people started going then. But when it was mostly trailers and people who lived in Las Conchas, Memorial Day was usually the last weekend people would come down until late September or early October. Someone in the 90's told me in late July/ August everyone from Penasco who can shuts down and packs up to get out of town- even the guy at Vazquez liquor in Sonoyta would pack up a trailer and drive to the North East of the US to sell his curios.
When condo people collect the 11% IVA tax, some of that goes to the cities, so yes, condo occupancy and Mayan occupancy rates do matter. If some condo owners do not collect that, and they'll have the Hacienda to deal with!
So you can say nasty things, my point was parts of this town are getting busier again. No, it may not as you would say "like the good old days"- AKA 2007, but it's better than the last couple of years, and better than prior to 2004.
Have ya noticed how negativity seems to always creep into our threads? The thread started out as compliment to a forum member and has ended as a "my dad can beat up your dad" slug fest. I'm not all sunshine and rainbows, but, come on...... give me a break and let Rosie have her compliment!
Just an FYI, 100% of the moneys I collect for “rentals” stays in RP. Even though I (we) have busy times and celebrate “rah” “rah” there is not enough yearly business for us to make much more than expenses. Because of the “rentals” there are thousands of people employed doing various services directly and indirectly. Yes the renter’s pays taxes when they rent, I pay taxes on that income, I pay property taxes, the management company pays taxes, all of the employees pay taxes. If there was a huge gathering of people at the parks that did not rent “property“ and they all spent their money in town and I did not directly benefit from it I would be happy for all of the businesses and if they celebrated I would join them, because I know times have been tough and they need it. But again that’s just me and since I am new to this forum I may be missing something.
Did it ever occur to any of the Mirador fans that the Mirador is not the barometer for success in RP as it once was, but that in general the Mirador is not the "it" place to be as it once was either? I don't even know enough about the Mirador to really comment on it, but from what I've seen the few times I've been down there at night, it's not someplace I'd want to hang out.
I first went to Manny's in June, 2003 the place was packed, we could hardly find a place to park and I was excited by all that I had heard about Manny's over the years. Once we went in there I was extremely surprised to find nothing but drunk gringo wanna-be gang-bangers with shaved heads and their baseball hats tipped to the side, baggy-a** shorts hangin' low with a chip on their shoulder, and women with missing teeth.
I've been inside the Pink Cadillac once in June 2008 - same type of customers. No thanks. Been to the old Margaritavilla once in November, 2008 - even worse - a bunch of drunk, old men.
Trust me, I don't need to hang out at some ritzy, upper class restaurant/bar. I eat street tacos and go to Barra Vieja on Calle 13 to listen to the band and the whole place smells like piss. Maybe "back in the day" Manny's and those other places were fun to hang out in, but from what I saw, it didn't look too fun to me.
Everything changes - I just think RP is having an identity crisis and once the economy gets back on track it will be different than before. Not better, not worse - just different. I'm sorry for those of you that have fond memories of the past, but that's just the way life is.
One more specific comment: I was at Las Palomas for a week over the 4th. People were ordering drinks by the pool like CRAZY. Gringos, Mexicans, Mexican Americans. I ordered one drink, realized how expensive it was and never ordered another. But yes, it was crowded and people were spending money.
OK, so we come to PP about once a month, sometime more. We have our own place outside of town (not a condo) and due to our tight budget, we bring many items with us! But, we do purchase fruits & veggies, beer, water and ice, propane & staples for the house AND we typically eat out at least once while were there. We quit buying $10 shrimp cocktail at the maleon, opting to purchase the shrimp and make it ourselves at home. While we may not spend as much as if we were staying in a hotel on the beach, I like to think that my measly $100 or so does help the town. Oh yeah, we also buy gas for the truck.
I've been coming down since about 1985.....and was one of the crazy ones who came down during the summer months. I spent a week each month during the kids summer vacation.....and my recollection (although I am starting to suffer from senility) is that the 4th of July was ALWAYS packed....I used to stay at Playa Bonita....and you had trouble getting a camping spot for that time. There was 2 way traffic on the beach in front of the campground (before they cracked down on the atv, etc.). Yeah...the campground cleared out pretty much after that until Labor Day.
I btrought up the point about the tax becuase I don't know where the hacienda allocates the money it collects.....if some of it goes to the town...that's great....but I also saw a post on here that indicated that recently the city was not able to make payroll for the police. Don't know how true the post was.....but with the increase in occupancy, there should be more tax money coming in.
As for "negativity"....I prefer to call it "reality"! You're always going to have disagreement on here about anything and everything....we've seen that on the "violence" issue. Many of us have strong feelings about Penasco....but look at things thru different colored glasses. Then there are those on here who have agendas...and not necessarily bad agendas.....which tend to color the lenses on their glasses.
I agree with Joe, I've been down 4 times since Memorial day and the town does seem to be busier. The beaches in Cholla were crowded with Nationals and Locals, more than I have ever seen in 20 years.
After speaking with owners of JJ's, Glorias Farmacia and the Manager at Mary's Old Port, they all said the same thing.
A ton of Nationals visiting RP from S.California and Tijuana and not much spending happening.
I don't think RP will get back to the old days until a new group of visitors discover it's charm.
So many of the people that used to keep the Manny's, Pink Caddy etc. going, are older with families and new agendas and places to go.
My teenage kid's don't like to go anymore because they can't stay connected with all their friends. No texting allowed. I make them go anyway.
Joe – 1985, lol, we also came down then as a group for the 4th of July weekends and stayed at Playa Bonita. We did that for many years. We were the ones that always took up 4 or 5 beach front spots and had a huge canopy set-up. We got in trouble every time for moving the bumpers when we combined spaces. Also my kids got in trouble a lot for not pushing the ATC’s out of the park. I have some videos from those weekends maybe you’re on there?
Dan....I used to have a chevy van....tried to get a beachfront...but if not...the next row over....had the van with the big slider door facing the water to get the breeze....had a canopy setup (wasn't the purpose of the those bumpers to tie down your canopy to???), table with a little microwave.....went up to the office area in the afternoon for a siesta on the benches in the shade...with that breeze funneling in. Eventually graduated to a trailer.... Remember watering the roof of the trailer (those rubber roofs) in the evening in case some of the fireworks came back from the beach...even had some rockets hit the rv next to mine.....
Went over to the hotel during happy hour....$1 margaritas to let my daughter swim in the pool.....after spending almost all day in the ocean!
July and August are not good times for measuring Rocky Point tourism. Mid-July to mid-September, and mid-November through mid-March are basically crossed off my list as Rocky Point visiting times. These are all prime times for doing other things in other places like the White Mtns of Arizona, the Rockies and the temperate California coast. What goes on mid-March to early July and mid-Septembe to mid-November is a better barometer of American tourism. I don't know whether Mexican tourism is on the same schedule since Mexico does not have the high-altitude/northern latitude alternatives we have in the US.
The Mirador is not a significant part of the Rocky Point experience for me. I particularly do not care for Manny's. It is not up to my standards, and I'm sorry but my standards aren't budging.
Rocky Point is indeed having an identity crisis. Rocky Point was never Loreto, but it once had a quaint charm that could have been built on with minimal investment. Now it is permanently over-shadowed by the intrusive monoliths of industrial tourism (Tessoro, the pigeon coops, Mayan Palace, etc.), and I'm not sure it can do much but continue in that sorry direction once the economy turns around. I'm expressing my subjective preference only, but Rocky Point can expect to lose the business of other Americans who share my preferences.
Maybe the best hope for the Mirador area is to re-invent itself as Old Rocky Point South with antique stores, quality art and furnishings and restaurants that ladies like (cobblestones, fountains, vines, patios.) Located conveniently for Las Conchas and adventurers from the Mayan Palace, it might be able to compete successfully with the Malecon/downtown area by simply offering one amenity that is scarce in Rocky Point: convenient parking.
The highway improvements to the south are mixed blessing. While it's possible that other Sea of Cortez/Mexican-quaint-village experiences will appear, I suspect we'll mainly see more grand scale projects that you'd have to pay me to stay at. And I hear there's a saying in Mexico that "at the end of bad roads, you will find good people. At the end of good roads, you will find all kinds of people." So much for the Steinbeck-like innocence of the Sea of Cortez and its coastline. I'm aware that there was always potential for problems of the worst kind in these remote stretches, but I suspect crime between Rocky Point and San Carlos will only get worse with more traffic and development.
Finally, as Esperanza noted, this forum does sometimes seem like a rough joint where things can come apart fast over the slightest perceived insult, which is surprising since it is centered around a place known for good times and relaxation, and you would think everyone would be laid back and in good spirits. I hate to think what it might be like without a bouncer like Stuart to toss out the rowdies, morons and the truly mean.
Well, first of all, thank you Miramar, Esperanza and those who liked the video. I'm never fully comfortable with the way those things turn out, so the positive feedback is always appreciated.
I read through the posts and saw the ridiculous poo-pooing thats going on:
- "Oh, those aren't tourists with real money to spend...they're POCHOS!"
- "You call THIS tourism? I remember the heyday!"
- And other variations of "Humbug!"
All I can say is that some tourists are better than none and this year we're seeing more traffic than we have in three years. I spoke with Kurt Geisler and he tells me he's having a great year. I just got off the phone with Marcos of SeaSide in Princesa and he tells me they've been packed for the last three month straight. My insurance business is doing pretty darn good and this month I've fielded calls from people interested in buying property or condos.
Manny's, whether it's your cup of tea or not, had 300 people in there a week ago Saturday and while I don't have the numbers for last week, he was expecting to do even better. Yes, those are primarily locals (I can actually hear some of you say eww...), but money is money and activity is activity. I've seen Flavio's packed, so I don't know what the fuss is about that. I've seen Latitude 31 pretty busy too. As has been mentioned here, the hot summer months aren't traditionally busy in RP. We're all kind of wondering why the sudden change, but it's a good thing nonetheless.
I find it ironic that on another thread the discussion is about stocking up in the States and bringing food and supplies down with you, and in this thread it's what we're accusing the POCHOS of doing. MJ, I happen to resent your use of the word and your incorrect generalizations, but it's a free forum so go for it if it helps you feel like you're sounding more "in the know". From what I can tell by your previous posts...your ego does need the...hmm, okay, crotch-grabbing will do. Too bad your ego-boosting isn't as subtle as I'm sure you think it is.
I don't get all the whoo doo on this topic or the Pimps and hoes topic either. I think it's a function of summer bordom, too hot to do much other than sit in front of the computer. Again I am amused by reporting and responses from 'those in the know', the people who visit 10 or even 20 days a year, WOW. It has been pointed out several times in the past, how the occasional visitor has a much, much better understanding of Penasco than those fools who acutally live here, 365 days a year, 24 hours a day. It's more important to be able to report that you remember a trip in 1995 and how much different it was then than it is now or make a little hackneyed joke report about someone selling his 'Seester", or refer people to a business that has been closed for years.
Even a casual observer who lives here, has noticed that the market has becoming more and more a Mexican market. It's a convenient beach destination for several very large cities besides Phoenix. Good, bad or indifferent what's all the blather about. Yes, Mexicans spend money differently from US folk and the Irish for that matter. Yes there have been a lot of Mexican visitors. I saw 4 busses from Chihuahua unloading a few days ago. Mid July is the time that a variety of Govt. offices and businesses actually close for vacation. We have always seen a boost during this period, and it has gotten bigger over the years. Some of you all seem to be complaining about this. What's the deal? Yes we had a round of complaints from US folk that reported they always brought all their food, beer and stuff from the US, now we've got comments because Hispanics from the US are doing it too !!:crybaby::crybaby::crybaby:
Truthfully, I don't begin to get the point. The name of the town is Puerto Penasco, there have been hoe houses here for a long time. Crystal Palace, Margarita villa location and some others. Calle 13 late night has always been what it is today, sort of the soft underbelly of a more civilized town. Sorry to tell you but you can buy drugs in the Fish Markets on the Malecon at more locations than on Calle 13. Virtually every city has formal and informal locations for specific activities and as long as they do it there and not elswhere no one complains too much. Shockingly too there have always been Mexicans visiting Penasco. Boggles the mind eh ?
I don't get all the whoo doo on this topic or the Pimps and hoes topic either. I think it's a function of summer bordom, too hot to do much other than sit in front of the computer. Again I am amused by reporting and responses from 'those in the know', the people who visit 10 or even 20 days a year, WOW. It has been pointed out several times in the past, how the occasional visitor has a much, much better understanding of Penasco than those fools who acutally live here, 365 days a year, 24 hours a day. It's more important to be able to report that you remember a trip in 1995 and how much different it was then than it is now or make a little hackneyed joke report about someone selling his 'Seester", or refer people to a business that has been closed for years.
Even a casual observer who lives here, has noticed that the market has becoming more and more a Mexican market. It's a convenient beach destination for several very large cities besides Phoenix. Good, bad or indifferent what's all the blather about. Yes, Mexicans spend money differently from US folk and the Irish for that matter. Yes there have been a lot of Mexican visitors. I saw 4 busses from Chihuahua unloading a few days ago. Mid July is the time that a variety of Govt. offices and businesses actually close for vacation. We have always seen a boost during this period, and it has gotten bigger over the years. Some of you all seem to be complaining about this. What's the deal? Yes we had a round of complaints from US folk that reported they always brought all their food, beer and stuff from the US, now we've got comments because Hispanics from the US are doing it too !!:crybaby::crybaby::crybaby:
Truthfully, I don't begin to get the point. The name of the town is Puerto Penasco, there have been hoe houses here for a long time. Crystal Palace, Margarita villa location and some others. Calle 13 late night has always been what it is today, sort of the soft underbelly of a more civilized town. Sorry to tell you but you can buy drugs in the Fish Markets on the Malecon at more locations than on Calle 13. Virtually every city has formal and informal locations for specific activities and as long as they do it there and not elswhere no one complains too much. Shockingly too there have always been Mexicans visiting Penasco. Boggles the mind eh ?
¿Kind of Canadian eh? lol its a joke dont get mad like others......geez![/QUOTE]
Now you'll start a whole off topic discussion of Canadian complaints. "I remember when I went to Quebec in the 70's......." Actually I think it's a bit more Brit than Canadian. I've always sort of fancied using that phrase meself.
On Edit: OK, got it, not the boggles, but the eh. There's a Mexican version too !!!
I didnt even know the term pocho till 3 weeks ago when a business owner in RP said that he cant have pocho clients because they drink too much beer. This is a boat charter and the beer is free but for the price per head basically everything becomes free. I was like hhhmmmmm that sounds about right and now I love the term. MY EGO IS GROWING EXPONENTIALLY.
When one of the most POPULAR BARS in TOWN closes for an ENTIRE MONTH, town is not busy. There are no social venues and thats unfortunate. When the most popular bar in RP is making it through the toughest times, watching as other businesses crack and crumble and they still have to CLOSE for an ENTIRE MONTH TOWN IS NOT BUSY. HOW THE HELL DO YOU CLOSE A BAR FOR AN ENTIRE MONTH hahahahahaha, thats SO CONTRADICTORY of TOWN IS BUSY COME ONE COME ALL!!!!!!!!!!!
maybe this is more of an appropriate observation based on changing demographic...
tipping down
nightclubs down
bars down
hotel occupancy up
condos up
hotel restaurants/bars up
lodging taxes up
strip clubs down
taco stands hold?
chiclet sales down
trinket sales down
nutela sales up
atv & other rentals up
Mex Joe, I'm tired of the nasty comments and your ego- my personal favorite: "Pochos dont spend money, you know who spends money? The 20-35 demographic who has to have all the latest phones, devices of all kinds, audio, flat screens, my wheels are better than yours, well my C class is better than yours, seriously these people and Im one of them have the DEEPEST pockets in AMERICA! . (And biggest egos).
Another one when I was talking about the Multiplier Effect of people spending money, and you answered: "Ha! You must have slept through economics class Miramar because thats not what the "Multiplier Effect" is. The Money Multiplier Effect refers to the multiplication of money through interest rates. Sorry buddy, do you remember what your grade was in the class?" ..... MexJoe, I got an A in all Economics classes I took in graduate school, but as a primer, here is what the Multiplier Effect is (simple explanation for you): "Simply put, when someone spends money, they make someone else money. That person then goes and spends that money, helping someone else to make money.
Person #1 —-spends—-> Person #2 —-spends—-> Person #3
Around and around the money goes, increasing the perceived wealth of everyone as more dollars eventually flow back into building bigger buildings, investors invest back into companies to help them grow and hire more workers, and entertainment spending increases as people have more discretionary income to spend."
A little more complex: When this multiplier exceeds one, the enhanced effect on income is called the multiplier effect. The mechanism that can give rise to a multiplier effect is that an initial incremental amount of spending can lead to increased consumption spending, increasing income further and hence further increasing consumption, etc., resulting in an overall increase in income greater than the initial incremental amount of spending.
My initial post was to say thanks to Rosy for producing a video to encourage people to come to Penasco. The other was to point out Rosy & Russ' radio show. If you have a comment to make, that's fine, but stop the name calling and bloviating.
Miramar, specifically tell me who I called a name! I didnt call anyone on this sight a name! Get your facts straight! Also, Im sure that sounds like a good and reasonable explanation of the MONEY MULTIPLIER EFFECT, however you are so wrong its a laugher. Did someone do your homework for you?! MIRAMAR YOU JUST DUG A BIG HOLE FOR YOURSELF MY FRIEND. You shouldnt claim that you know what the MME is if you have no idea. LITTLE ROSY must not know anything about the MME either because she THANKS your input and highly regards it as FACT, however YOU have no idea what you're talking about. The Money Multiplier Effect is money generated by Banks REGARDING FEDERAL RESERVE LIMITS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
"The multiplier effect depends on the set reserve requirement. So, to calculate the impact of the multiplier effect on the money supply, we start with the amount banks initially take in through deposits and divide this by the reserve ratio. If, for example, the reserve requirement is 20%, for every $100 a customer deposits into a bank, $20 must be kept in reserve. However, the remaining $80 can be loaned out to other bank customers. This $80 is then deposited by these customers into another bank, which in turn must also keep 20%, or $16, in reserve but can lend out the remaining $64. This cycle continues - as more people deposit money and more banks continue lending it - until finally the $100 initially deposited creates a total of $500 ($100 / 0.2) in deposits. This creation of deposits is the multiplier effect." (http://www.investopedia.com/terms/m/multipliereffect.asp).
MIRAMAR I HAVE a BIG EGO and BIG EDUCATION. LITTLE ROSY, you just THANKED a post that was completely wrong and you're a business woman?
Person #1 —-spends—-> Person #2 —-spends—-> Person #3 hahahahahahahahahahahahaha seriously??????!!!!!!!!! Hahaha I would have gotten an A tambien if ECONOMICS was that easy! What a joke! Im sure I seem like the AHOLE now....
Yes I would like the Money Multiplier Effect for a thousand! Yes, the Money Multiplier Effect is when person #1 spends money and then Person #2 spends money and then Person #3 spends money and then person #4.... Alex Tribec is looking at you in disgust, shaking his head like, wow thats really what you came up with. Thanks MIRAMAR MY EGO WAS VERY HUNGRY!!!!!!!!!!!!
MexJoe, I got an A in all Economics classes I took in graduate school, but as a primer, here is what the Multiplier Effect is (simple explanation for you): "Simply put, when someone spends money, they make someone else money. That person then goes and spends that money, helping someone else to make money.
Im glad you dumbed it down for me MIRAMAR. Thanks for insulting me I appreciate it. "SIMPLE EXPLANATION FOR YOU, SIMPLY PUT"............... Im not an idiot so you dont have to put anything SIMPLY. Miramar please break it down into lehmans terms for me please, " Mexico Joe please let me explain this in a more simple manner, simply put, the Money Multiplier Effect is when I spend money and then the next person makes the money and then they spend the money and then so on and so on. Mexico Joe do you get it? Thats as simple as I can make it. What college did you go to again? I want to email your answer to your economics professor so he can feel as ashamed as you should feel.
I apologize because maybe you misunderstood me when I said that, "we have deep pockets". I wasnt referring to how much money this generation or myself has, rather the fact that we'll spend our last amounts of money to, have fun, have a the newest coolest gadget, whatever the case may be. My ego isnt making this stuff up, theres been research done on this, its called MARKET TRENDS and yes my generation is in the forefront.
Five posts in a row? Don't look now, but your slip is showing, Dude. I thanked MIRAMAR for two things; for trying to bring the thread back to thanking me and Russ for our efforts and promoting the radio show and then for calling you out on that stupid "deepest pockets in America" comment.
You obviously fancy yourself a smart guy. Too bad you haven't figured out that if you were really that smart, you wouldn't have to keep telling people you are. I can tell people I'm not smart at all. I can say I don't know <WASH MY MOUTH OUT WITH SOAP><WASH MY MOUTH OUT WITH SOAP><WASH MY MOUTH OUT WITH SOAP><WASH MY MOUTH OUT WITH SOAP> about the MME effect and never studied economics. I further say that I never took a writing class or prepared in any way for having a radio program.
Oh yeah...but I have a radio show, run a successful business, contribute to my community and try to find time to write. Unlike some people, I don't hide behind an internet persona. Anyone reading my words knows exactly who I am and what I do...and I don't let that stop me from being straightforward and sharing my opinions. What's your claim to fame? Being a blowhard?
P.S. While you were getting your fancy higher education did you ever think about taking a basic spelling class?
Five posts in a row? Don't look now, but your slip is showing, Dude. I thanked MIRAMAR for two things; for trying to bring the thread back to thanking me and Russ for our efforts and promoting the radio show and then for calling you out on that stupid "deepest pockets in America" comment.
You obviously fancy yourself a smart guy. Too bad you haven't figured out that if you were really that smart, you wouldn't have to keep telling people you are. I can tell people I'm not smart at all. I can say I don't know <WASH MY MOUTH OUT WITH SOAP><WASH MY MOUTH OUT WITH SOAP><WASH MY MOUTH OUT WITH SOAP><WASH MY MOUTH OUT WITH SOAP> about the MME effect and never studied economics. I further say that I never took a writing class or prepared in any way for having a radio program.
Oh yeah...but I have a radio show, run a successful business, contribute to my community and try to find time to write. Unlike some people, I don't hide behind an internet persona. Anyone reading my words knows exactly who I am and what I do...and I don't let that stop me from being straightforward and sharing my opinions. What's your claim to fame? Being a blowhard?
P.S. While you were getting your fancy higher education did you ever think about taking a basic spelling class?
When one of the most POPULAR BARS in TOWN closes for an ENTIRE MONTH, town is not busy. There are no social venues and thats unfortunate. When the most popular bar in RP is making it through the toughest times, watching as other businesses crack and crumble and they still have to CLOSE for an ENTIRE MONTH TOWN IS NOT BUSY. HOW THE HELL DO YOU CLOSE A BAR FOR AN ENTIRE MONTH hahahahahaha, thats SO CONTRADICTORY of TOWN IS BUSY COME ONE COME ALL!!!!!!!!!!!
Popularity changes. Maybe it's NOT the most popular bar in town. Maybe it WAS the most popular bar in town. You are living in the past.
My teenage kid's don't like to go anymore because they can't stay connected with all their friends. No texting allowed. I make them go anyway.
hahahaha i just about fell over when i saw this but i'm sure it's true! then i remembered as a teen, during an entire trip at a boat house on a lake in Wisconsin, i spent the whole time indoors watching this new thing called MTV. priorities...
It all goes under the auspices of: "no good deed goes unpunished"!
Well, you know if people wouldn't go around making videos and if people woulden't go around watching them and people wouldn't go around talking about them these trainwrecks would not happen, soooo whose fault is it?????
Well, you know if people wouldn't go around making videos and if people woulden't go around watching them and people wouldn't go around talking about them these trainwrecks would not happen, soooo whose fault is it?????
Me again? Dang it. I just just can't seem to help stepping in the poop, can I?