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domromer
Guest
Thats funny, I didn't know sierras were salt cod/bacalau.I grew up with a lot of Portuguese friends and that was their fish of chice.
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domromer
Guest
Wat are corvinas and sierras the same thing?
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domromer
Guest
Man all this fishing talk is making me crazy! This is what I was doing last week.
Red Drum
Guest
Those are Jack Crevalle and Spanish Mackeral in the cooler, and a Pompano in the picture above this post.
Mexican Gaftopsail Pompano
http://www.google.com/imgres?imgurl=http://www.reel1in.com/images/Gaftopsail-Pompano.jpg&imgrefurl=http://www.reel1in.com/Gaftopsail-Pompano.html&usg=__mQbPrxMVQZr5VXzgrGeiM34lwiY=&h=323&w=350&sz=20&hl=en&start=3&itbs=1&tbnid=d06-0EiE2h1aBM:&tbnh=111&tbnw=120&prev=/images?q=mexican+pompano&hl=en&gbv=2&tbs=isch:1
Florida Pompano
http://www.google.com/imgres?imgurl=http://www.landbigfish.com/images/fish/pompano.jpg&imgrefurl=http://www.landbigfish.com/fish/fish.cfm?ID=119&usg=__WGSfUHLFKGlgOM3QtyL2h8oTELk=&h=365&w=600&sz=22&hl=en&start=1&itbs=1&tbnid=UO4WMuoj7a1AUM:&tbnh=82&tbnw=135&prev=/images?q=pompano&hl=en&gbv=2&tbs=isch:1
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I have two sources for identifying fish around Rocky Point. The first is:
http://www.mexfish.com/fish/fish.htm
The other is a book entitled Gulf of California Fishwater's Guide by Donald A Thomson and Nonie McKibben (1976) published in Tucson. The book helps because the website doesn't group fish by families or necessarily use the same fish name you're looking for. Fish identification can be confusing because there are often many names for the same fish, and fish are sometimes incorrectly called by the names of similar fish found elsewhere. I believe the latter may be the case with pompano.
I believe the bloody fish in the picture above is a palomas pompano and is probably the only type of pompano found around Rocky Pt. The book has it among the jacks and says jacks in general are highly regarded game and food fishes. The website says palomoas pompano is considered excellent table fare among "locals." But then if you travel to Asia you'll find "locals" who consider carp escellent table fare, so I suspect I'll just have to try some in order to know for sure.
I believe the corvinas around Rocky Pt. are either gulf or shortfin, and I hear there are a few orangemouths around as well. They are also called sea trout, and they do look something like trout. (I had thought the fish on the top in the cooler picture was a corvina, and that fish does look like a trout to me.) I'm told corvina are very mild-tasting (too mild for some), and I'm sure they would make good breaded fish tacos. I've made two fairly serious efforts to catch corvina but haven't timed it right yet.
There is a highly regarded pompano around Florida, but I believe this is a different fish from what we have in the Sea of Cortez. Similar maybe, but not the same fish. I believe there is also another kind of corvina (or sea trout, weakfish, etc.) in other ocean waters beyond the Sea of Cortez.
http://www.mexfish.com/fish/fish.htm
The other is a book entitled Gulf of California Fishwater's Guide by Donald A Thomson and Nonie McKibben (1976) published in Tucson. The book helps because the website doesn't group fish by families or necessarily use the same fish name you're looking for. Fish identification can be confusing because there are often many names for the same fish, and fish are sometimes incorrectly called by the names of similar fish found elsewhere. I believe the latter may be the case with pompano.
I believe the bloody fish in the picture above is a palomas pompano and is probably the only type of pompano found around Rocky Pt. The book has it among the jacks and says jacks in general are highly regarded game and food fishes. The website says palomoas pompano is considered excellent table fare among "locals." But then if you travel to Asia you'll find "locals" who consider carp escellent table fare, so I suspect I'll just have to try some in order to know for sure.
I believe the corvinas around Rocky Pt. are either gulf or shortfin, and I hear there are a few orangemouths around as well. They are also called sea trout, and they do look something like trout. (I had thought the fish on the top in the cooler picture was a corvina, and that fish does look like a trout to me.) I'm told corvina are very mild-tasting (too mild for some), and I'm sure they would make good breaded fish tacos. I've made two fairly serious efforts to catch corvina but haven't timed it right yet.
There is a highly regarded pompano around Florida, but I believe this is a different fish from what we have in the Sea of Cortez. Similar maybe, but not the same fish. I believe there is also another kind of corvina (or sea trout, weakfish, etc.) in other ocean waters beyond the Sea of Cortez.
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TerryV
Guest
We come down to RP every other year or so. The last visit we caught quite a few Longjaw Leatherback right off the beach at the Mayan. we also caught some Corvina as you approach the mouth of La Pinta estuary.
Will be down again this june and plan on parking my butt near the channels of La Pinta as the tide comes in.
Will be down again this june and plan on parking my butt near the channels of La Pinta as the tide comes in.
jmcdtucson
Guest
Maybe I'll see you there. I'll be down June 7-11 and plan on launching the kayak into La Pinta sometime around high tide. I had good luck on corvina there last fall.
I've caught some of those leatherback on Kastmasters off the beach southeast of Morua estuary. Along with needlefish and puffer fish. And, of course, lots of sand sharks on squid. This year I may try eating one of those sand sharks.
Shore_Fisher
Guest
I'm not sure why the subject of leatherjacks came up, unless it's to inform us that what people are calling pompano around Rocky Point are actually leatherjacks.
If there are really any pompano around RP, I believe it's the Paloma Pompano. I say that because Mexfish states that Palomas are found up the upper gulf, but the Gafftopsail are further South. Here's what Mexfish said about Gafftopsails:
"The Gafftopsail Pompano cannot be easily confused with other species with the possible exception being the Paloma Pompano, Trachinotus paitensis (which has shorter fins and no bars).
The Gafftopsail Pompano is pelagic and found out around the tip of the Baja California peninsula, from Magdalena Bay south along the Pacific side of Baja, in the lower two-thirds of the Sea of Cortez, and on mainland Mexico south of Mazatlan. It is found in the first 75 feet of the water column over sandy bottoms adjacent to rocky structure and can be caught just outside the breaker line.
The Gafftopsail Pompano is reported to reach a length of 24 inches but is normally in the 14 to 16 inch range. It is viewed by locals to be excellent table fare."
Gafftopsail Pompano, Trachinotus rhodopus: Caught from shore in the last hour of daylight in February 2003, in 70-degree water outside the breaker line in 20 to 30-foot water, utilizing 15-pound test with a two dropper loop rig, no swivels, 1.5-ounce bank sinker, and Mustad 92553 hooks, size #4, on cut squid at Km. 14 (Twin Dolphins), between Cabo San Lucas and San Jose del Cabo, Baja California Sur, Mexico. Size approximately 12 inches and 1 pound and gave a medium fight. Viewed by locals as excellent table fair. Description and photo courtesy John Snow.
Gafftopsail Pompano, Trachinotus rhodopus: This super specimen photo of a Gafftopsail Pompano, 17 inches long, caught on 8-pound line from the beach on squid at Bahia de Palmas, East Cape, Baja California Sur, Mexico, October 1994. Says veteran Baja angler Peter, "This is just about the greatest lightweight fighter of all." Description and photo courtesy Peter Langstraat.
Gafftopsail Pompano, Trachinotus rhodopus: Caught from the beach Todos Santos, Baja California Sur, Mexico on cut squid in July 2005. Description and photo courtesy Dr. Robert Mierendorf.
If there are really any pompano around RP, I believe it's the Paloma Pompano. I say that because Mexfish states that Palomas are found up the upper gulf, but the Gafftopsail are further South. Here's what Mexfish said about Gafftopsails:
"The Gafftopsail Pompano cannot be easily confused with other species with the possible exception being the Paloma Pompano, Trachinotus paitensis (which has shorter fins and no bars).
The Gafftopsail Pompano is pelagic and found out around the tip of the Baja California peninsula, from Magdalena Bay south along the Pacific side of Baja, in the lower two-thirds of the Sea of Cortez, and on mainland Mexico south of Mazatlan. It is found in the first 75 feet of the water column over sandy bottoms adjacent to rocky structure and can be caught just outside the breaker line.
The Gafftopsail Pompano is reported to reach a length of 24 inches but is normally in the 14 to 16 inch range. It is viewed by locals to be excellent table fare."
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bahiatrader
Guest
They are for sure good eating.
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TerryV
Guest
JMCD, will be there that same week. If you see someone away from the hotel give me a yell.
Mexico Joe
Cholla Bay 4 Life
These Are LeatherJacks
These are leatherjacks caught from shore in Cholla Bay back in March, high tide. I originally was confused and thought they were Pampano. Even after asking a few knowledgable people I was still told they were Pompano. I believe these are caught as often as Pompano and are mistakenly called Pompano. They are leatherback jacks and from what i understand make excellent bait. I too am still on the quest to land some of my first corvinas, and possibly with the ultimate goal of catching sea trout.
These are leatherjacks caught from shore in Cholla Bay back in March, high tide. I originally was confused and thought they were Pampano. Even after asking a few knowledgable people I was still told they were Pompano. I believe these are caught as often as Pompano and are mistakenly called Pompano. They are leatherback jacks and from what i understand make excellent bait. I too am still on the quest to land some of my first corvinas, and possibly with the ultimate goal of catching sea trout.
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bahiatrader
Guest
I always thought they were pompanos. Someone from Rocky Point told me that's what they are. They fight good and taste good. A rose by any other name...
This is most confusing. Should I conclude that there are no true pompano in the waters around Rocky Point?
If there is, it's probably this one - the paloma. But note that while Mexfish says paloma pompano are found in all Mexican waters (unlike the Gafftopsail pompano,) it also says palomas are one of the rarer species in Mexican waters.
http://www.mexfish.com/apgs/tbc3/tbc3.htm
The Paloma Pompano is characterized by a silver, slender body that is darker on the upper back and whiter on the bottom.
It has a rounded snout, a straight lateral line and no blotch on the pectoral fin base.
This species can be easily confused with the Silver Pompano, Trachinotus kennedyi (which has a rounded head and a black blotch on the pectoral fin base).
The Paloma Pompano is pelagic and found in all Mexican waters including around the oceanic islands. It is found in the first 75 feet of the water column over sandy bottoms.
The Paloma Pompano is reported to reach a length of 20 inches but is normally in the 10 to 14 inch range.
It is viewed by locals to be excellent table fare.
Paloma Pompano, Trachinotus paitensis: Caught off the beach at Todos Santos, Baja California Sur, Mexico, in 68-degree water, in March 2008, on cut squid bait, utilizing traditional surf gear. Size approximately 18 inches and weight 4 pounds. Description and photo courtesy of John Snow.
Paloma Pompano, Trachinotus paitensis: Caught from shore in the last hour of daylight, in December 2001, in 76-degree water, outside the breaker line in 20 to 30-foot water, utilizing 15-pound test with a two dropper loop rig, no swivels, 1.5-ounce bank sinker, and Mustad 92553 hooks, size #4, on cut squid at Km. 14 (Twin Dolphins), between Cabo San Lucas and San Jose del Cabo, Baja California Sur., Mexico. Size approximately 10 inches and 1 pound. Viewed by locals as excellent table fare. Description courtesy John Snow. Picture courtesy Carol Snow
If there is, it's probably this one - the paloma. But note that while Mexfish says paloma pompano are found in all Mexican waters (unlike the Gafftopsail pompano,) it also says palomas are one of the rarer species in Mexican waters.
http://www.mexfish.com/apgs/tbc3/tbc3.htm
Paloma Pompano
Pámpano
(Trachinotus paitensis)
Fish Identification Photos: Paloma Pompano, Trachinotus paitensis: The Paloma Pompano is one of the rarer species in Mexican waters and is a member of the Carangidae or Jack Family.Pámpano
(Trachinotus paitensis)
The Paloma Pompano is characterized by a silver, slender body that is darker on the upper back and whiter on the bottom.
It has a rounded snout, a straight lateral line and no blotch on the pectoral fin base.
This species can be easily confused with the Silver Pompano, Trachinotus kennedyi (which has a rounded head and a black blotch on the pectoral fin base).
The Paloma Pompano is pelagic and found in all Mexican waters including around the oceanic islands. It is found in the first 75 feet of the water column over sandy bottoms.
The Paloma Pompano is reported to reach a length of 20 inches but is normally in the 10 to 14 inch range.
It is viewed by locals to be excellent table fare.
moore_rb
Stay Thirsty My Friends
Yes, it can get confusing.
Very few people in RP call Leatherjacks Leatherjacks- most call them Pompano, but they are indeed Leatherjacks. They are not closely related to Permit or Gafftopsail Pomano, except for the fact that they are all Jacks.
Now, that being said- both Paloma and Gafftopsail Pomano can be caught in RP- I've caught both out on Playa Encanto and while fly-fishing in the 1st Estuary (Marua)
I've caught maybe 10 Gafftopsails in all the years that I have shore fished these waters, so they are not commonly caught, and the biggest was maybe 12 inches. Each was a throwback for me.
Thanks, guys. That cleared up a question I'd had for years.
By the way, did anyone ever answer the original question - when's the best time to shore fish in RP?
I said April to October, but I just barely sort of half-way know what I'm talking about. And my focus is on corvina (which someone said is a croaker. I don't believe it is; corvinas are in the cynoscion family with white sea bass and tortoaba. See that Wahoo? I'm learning.)
By the way, did anyone ever answer the original question - when's the best time to shore fish in RP?
I said April to October, but I just barely sort of half-way know what I'm talking about. And my focus is on corvina (which someone said is a croaker. I don't believe it is; corvinas are in the cynoscion family with white sea bass and tortoaba. See that Wahoo? I'm learning.)
moore_rb
Stay Thirsty My Friends
Corvina, White SeaBass, Toatoba.... all are members of the croaker or drum family (Sciaenidae). On the Atlantic side- so are Redfish, Grey Drums, and speckled sea trout.
Regarding the "best time" to Shore fish- I'm going to say that the best times for catching surface fish (including Corvina) from shore are late April through early June, and then again from Mid-October to Mid-November (but you can still catch fish all summer long near dawn and dusk). and the best times to catch flounder (the tastiest fish you can catch from shore in RP, IMO) is from early Feb through early April.
These are my "best times" opinion, but you will certainly recieve other opinions as well.
Regarding the "best time" to Shore fish- I'm going to say that the best times for catching surface fish (including Corvina) from shore are late April through early June, and then again from Mid-October to Mid-November (but you can still catch fish all summer long near dawn and dusk). and the best times to catch flounder (the tastiest fish you can catch from shore in RP, IMO) is from early Feb through early April.
These are my "best times" opinion, but you will certainly recieve other opinions as well.
I stand corrected.
I missed the "croaker" classification because my author has all the "bass-like" croakers in a separate section, and I missed that these arecroakers too.
Everything Wahoo said agrees with my book, which was written by a professor who was chairman of the marine sciences program at the University of Arizona beginning in the 1960s.
Like some others before it, this thread has now been copied into a word file, printed and put in a folder. It's a keeper.
I missed the "croaker" classification because my author has all the "bass-like" croakers in a separate section, and I missed that these arecroakers too.
Everything Wahoo said agrees with my book, which was written by a professor who was chairman of the marine sciences program at the University of Arizona beginning in the 1960s.
Like some others before it, this thread has now been copied into a word file, printed and put in a folder. It's a keeper.
Like Jerry, we've always had the best shore fishing in June however, May comes along as a close second. We'll fish the incoming NITE tide for corvina. Advantage is its much cooler, no beach traffic, no pangas, and during the day we're fishing near/offshore. So, whats a fishing junkie to do before bed??? Fish s'more! BTW, we'll use 'chovies with casting bobbers. Keeps the bait off the bottom and NO rays, no sand sharks, just corvina Yippee! For daytime shore fishing remember saltwater rapalas. Cast far and largest shore fish I ever battled was on a rapala.