Sting Ray Bites

A

apricot

Guest
Jerry, good article. It can be scary if not treated right away, but this is the main thing I got out of it:

It is important to treat these injuries promptly. If the injury is not life-threatening, it is important to quickly cleanse the wound and submerge the foot in hot water to deactivate the tissue enzymes that cause pain and tissue necrosis.
 
R

rplarry

Guest
Mexico Joe said:
Again, wouldn't 3 or 4 Vicodin work?!
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Joe, that remedy would work, like Propofol worked for Michael Jackson. Definitely would temporarily kill the pain or problem, but is not the solution to the potential health issues.

When I was stung, part of the stinger's cartilage broke off in my foot. Luckily I had an experienced Red Cross worker who gave me a shot of Novocaine and then had to cut with scissors into my foot, and remove the broken off stinger . The Novocaine worked beautifully as my pain was completely gone. But when it wore off, the pain was 10 times worse than prior. I'm guessing because the venom was still there as I did not soak it in hot water, and then also the cutting of my foot. After about 3-4 hours of the worst pain in my life, it went away in an instant. Really weird. One minute wanted to put a .45 to my head, and the next, it was over.

Please everyone , just shuffle during this time of year. And, not a bad idea all year.

Interesting in that when I got back to to the States, started hearing crazy stories of others who had been stung by stingrays in RP. One buddy got stung, went to the Red Cross and they stitched up his wound with stitches. About a week later, he almost lost his leg from Gangrene. They stitched up not only the venom, but the same cartilage and stinger that they removed from my foot. He was incredibly lucky.

Seriously, you do not want to mess with these rays. We are in their territory, and we need to use caution while in their territory.

When I got stung, we were down for a quick 2 day fishing trip. Needless to say , we did not end up going fishing.

And, to Playperro comment on not drinking, we had just purchased a case of beer and it was so cold and tempting, but the doctor told us that the antibiotics I was taking for the sting would be compromised by any alcohol. He said basically, achohol cancels out the effects of the bacteria fighting of the antibiotics. Have heard that as well since then in the states

So, the story of that trip was... no fish, no beer, no fun, a lot of pain, and hopefully some new found wisdom.

Most importantly was the wisdom.

Shuffle, shuffle, and shuffle some more. Lots of hot water immediately.

And, do not let anyone stitch up your wound.
 
Landshark

Landshark

Guest
It would be good to have a thermometer to measure the hot water temperature. Supposed to be no hotter that 113 degrees. Every time I have treated a sting it gets crazy real fast and the one thing I'm never sure of is if I have the water too hot. They are going to be screaming when the foot goes in saying it's too hot even if it isn't. It would be good to be able to reassure them the temp is okay and will not scald them thus calming everyone down. Also good for maintaining the water temp as it cools by adding more hot water. The correct temp of hot water ASAP makes all the difference.
 
S

Southbeacher

Guest
apricot said:
Jerry, good article. It can be scary if not treated right away, but this is the main thing I got out of it:
It is important to treat these injuries promptly. If the injury is not life-threatening, it is important to quickly cleanse the wound and submerge the foot in hot water to deactivate the tissue enzymes that cause pain and tissue necrosis.
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Agree. From what I've heard and read, ray stings are pretty common and usually no big threat. If it is just an "owie" with a puncture, the cleansing-and-hot-water treatment is likely all that is required. Bigger rays, however, I've heard can leave more of a "hole" than a puncture. Those are the trip-to-doctor category (as would be a wound site in the chest). As far as infections, those less-common results can occur with all sorts of stinging/biting critters . . . such as the possibility of contracting the dreaded Mersa injected by an otherwise-innocuous spider bite. So initial cleansing is important . . . then monitor. The pain / symptoms should dissipate over a few hours rather than intensify.
 
Kenny

Kenny

Guest
rplarry said:
Joe, that remedy would work, like Propofol worked for Michael Jackson. Definitely would temporarily kill the pain or problem, but is not the solution to the potential health issues.

When I was stung, part of the stinger's cartilage broke off in my foot. Luckily I had an experienced Red Cross worker who gave me a shot of Novocaine and then had to cut with scissors into my foot, and remove the broken off stinger . The Novocaine worked beautifully as my pain was completely gone. But when it wore off, the pain was 10 times worse than prior. I'm guessing because the venom was still there as I did not soak it in hot water, and then also the cutting of my foot. After about 3-4 hours of the worst pain in my life, it went away in an instant. Really weird. One minute wanted to put a .45 to my head, and the next, it was over.

Please everyone , just shuffle during this time of year. And, not a bad idea all year.

Interesting in that when I got back to to the States, started hearing crazy stories of others who had been stung by stingrays in RP. One buddy got stung, went to the Red Cross and they stitched up his wound with stitches. About a week later, he almost lost his leg from Gangrene. They stitched up not only the venom, but the same cartilage and stinger that they removed from my foot. He was incredibly lucky.

Seriously, you do not want to mess with these rays. We are in their territory, and we need to use caution while in their territory.

When I got stung, we were down for a quick 2 day fishing trip. Needless to say , we did not end up going fishing.

And, to Playperro comment on not drinking, we had just purchased a case of beer and it was so cold and tempting, but the doctor told us that the antibiotics I was taking for the sting would be compromised by any alcohol. He said basically, achohol cancels out the effects of the bacteria fighting of the antibiotics. Have heard that as well since then in the states

So, the story of that trip was... no fish, no beer, no fun, a lot of pain, and hopefully some new found wisdom.

Most importantly was the wisdom.

Shuffle, shuffle, and shuffle some more. Lots of hot water immediately.

And, do not let anyone stitch up your wound.
Click to expand...
What is commonly left in the wound is not part of the "spear" that's broken off, but the protective sheath of the spear that comes off when the spear is pulled out. I've heard of it being compared to the sheath on a knife or spear and yes, it needs to be removed.
 
asprinkles

asprinkles

Guest
hopefully mine came out. Its purple but pretty much healed up. mine was on Saturday. hurt like hell. 2 hrs. hot water vicodan and tequila and was fine, except for a little sore next day.Leigh
 
mondone

mondone

Whitecaps
Mexico Joe said:
Surprised nobody has recommended going to any one of one hundred FARMACIAS and getting some of the good stuff... Sure, you'll pay $10 or 15 but after 3 or 4 Vicoten/Percs you'll be as good as new....
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Not every one can do that if you are subject to random drug testing from your employer MJ. Hydrocodone and Oxycodone turning up in your sample will surely guarantee you walking papers.
 
AZRob

AZRob

Guest
I just left my Doctors office, and while we were shooting the sh*t I asked him about stingray stings. I asked him about meat tenderizer and he explained to me that the tenderizer will neutralize the poison from the stinger but only on skin surface also on surface of wound. The hot water will help to do the same thing and will go in deeper of the wound to flush it. But the sting from a ray is like the sting from a scorpion, there is no anti venom. Each person's body acts different to the venom, its up to your body to neutralize what got into your blood and surrounding tissues. The time frame of the pain will vary from each individual.
He also told me that some people have died from a small scorpion sting, your kidneys and liver fail. He also added don't get to close to get stung in the chest or by major arteries, the venom will travel at a fast rate and affect the organs more rapidly and you have a good chance of dieing from it. Like Steve Irwin.
 
R

rplarry

Guest
Kenny said:
What is commonly left in the wound is not part of the "spear" that's broken off, but the protective sheath of the spear that comes off when the spear is pulled out. I've heard of it being compared to the sheath on a knife or spear and yes, it needs to be removed.
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Did not know that. Makes sense though.

Whatever it is, from what I have heard, if it stays in the wound it can cause big problems.
 
R

rplarry

Guest
AZRob said:
I just left my Doctors office, and while we were shooting the sh*t I asked him about stingray stings. I asked him about meat tenderizer and he explained to me that the tenderizer will neutralize the poison from the stinger but only on skin surface also on surface of wound. The hot water will help to do the same thing and will go in deeper of the wound to flush it. But the sting from a ray is like the sting from a scorpion, there is no anti venom. Each person's body acts different to the venom, its up to your body to neutralize what got into your blood and surrounding tissues. The time frame of the pain will vary from each individual.
He also told me that some people have died from a small scorpion sting, your kidneys and liver fail. He also added don't get to close to get stung in the chest or by major arteries, the venom will travel at a fast rate and affect the organs more rapidly and you have a good chance of dieing from it. Like Steve Irwin.
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Good to know how the reaction can be different from person to person. All I know is that for me, it was a living hell.

I wonder if people allergic to bees, or react worse than most people do to mosquitoes, spiders, etc would react worse to a stingray or scorpion?

Might not be a bad idea that if so, that person has an epipen ready and available.
 
Kenny

Kenny

Guest
The only humans at risk from a Scorpion sting are the very old or very young and it's from the neurotoxins that are in the venom that effect the nervous system. We're talking about paralysis, severe convulsions, cardiac irregularities, breathing difficulties, death. Symptoms to look for are difficulty breathing, uncontrolled jerking, drooling and wild eye movements.... There is a anti-venom.
I've been stung several times myself throughout the years and have researched Scorpion stings in AZ and Mexico numerous times.... Bottom line is I don't think your doctor knows what the hell he is talking about when he attributes kidney and liver failure to a Scorpion sting.


"Neurological manifestations- Centruroides Exilicada the
bark scorpion, seen in Arizona, new Mexico, western Texas,
southeast California and Nevada, venom is highly neurotoxin.
Mesobuthus Tamulus may cause focal neurological presentation
include hemi paresis, hemorrhagic or thrombotic stroke. DIC
is main contributory factors for neurological manifestations.56
Bahloul M et al from Tunisia reported 78% cases had neurological
complications due to Androctonus Australus envenomation.
Patient presented with coma, convulsions, hyperthermia, miosis
and mydriasis, brain edema had poor outcome. Majority of
victims neurological complications are secondary due to brain
anoxia caused by pulmonary edema and cardiovascular failure."
 
Roberto

Roberto

Guest
Had one in the casita about a week ago. It was a small one. I grabbed an empty can that was handy and dropped it open ended over the critter. After about an hour I lifted the can and the thing looked flattened out and shriveled up. I thought it was dead. It quickly came alive and scurried across the floor sending the GF and sister screaming. Thumped it with a broom handle, glad it did not bite one of two 18 month old boys watching the action. Gotta seal the entry door better.
 
AZRob

AZRob

Guest
Kenny said:
The only humans at risk from a Scorpion sting are the very old or very young and it's from the neurotoxins that are in the venom that effect the nervous system. We're talking about paralysis, severe convulsions, cardiac irregularities, breathing difficulties, death. Symptoms to look for are difficulty breathing, uncontrolled jerking, drooling and wild eye movements.... There is a anti-venom.
I've been stung several times myself throughout the years and have researched Scorpion stings in AZ and Mexico numerous times.... Bottom line is I don't think your doctor knows what the hell he is talking about when he attributes kidney and liver failure to a Scorpion sting.
You wrote.
"The only humans at risk from a Scorpion sting are the very old or very young and it's from the neurotoxins that are in the venom that effect the nervous system. We're talking about paralysis, severe convulsions, cardiac irregularities, breathing difficulties, death."




What about middle age people with conditions? As I wrote earlier, everyone's body handles it differently.

Paralysis is the loss of muscle function in part of your body. It happens when something goes wrong with the way messages pass between your brain and muscles. Paralysis can be complete or partial. It can occur on one or both sides of your body. It can also occur in just one area, or it can be widespread. Paralysis of the lower half of your body, including both legs, is called paraplegia. Paralysis of the arms and legs is quadriplegia.


From the kidneys, urine travels down two thin tubes called ureters to the bladder. The ureters are about 8 to 10 inches long. Muscles in the ureter walls constantly tighten and relax to force urine downward away from the kidneys. If urine is allowed to stand still, or back up, a kidney infection can develop. Small amounts of urine are emptied into the bladder from the ureters about every 10 to 15 seconds.

I only wasted time looking up the Kidney, if the muscles in the ureter stop working guess what happens. Hey Im just another guy on the beach that's just sharing info from a real Doctor.

Doctor Kenny, He does have the education, the certificate and hands on knowledge. Also he looks about the same age as yourself, so he's been around the block a few times. But everyone is welcome to their own opinion and belief.
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Kenny

Kenny

Guest
Roberto said:
Had one in the casita about a week ago. It was a small one. I grabbed an empty can that was handy and dropped it open ended over the critter. After about an hour I lifted the can and the thing looked flattened out and shriveled up. I thought it was dead. It quickly came alive and scurried across the floor sending the GF and sister screaming. Thumped it with a broom handle, glad it did not bite one of two 18 month old boys watching the action. Gotta seal the entry door better.
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Even though we lived in Phoenix at the time, it was at Natcho's huts in Cholla Bay back in the 50's that I learned to shake my shoe's out every morning.
 
playaperro

playaperro

El Pirata
Kenny said:
Even though we lived in Phoenix at the time, it was at Natcho's huts in Cholla Bay back in the 50's that I learned to shake my shoe's out every morning.
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You got any pics you were down in Penasco in the 50's or 60's, if not don't take credit for something your making up!
 
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