Vaquita war

audsley

Guest
I'm watching this with keen interest.

Mexican fishermen burn boat, demand environmentalists out
By MARK STEVENSON Associated Press

MARCH 27, 2017 — 3:35PM

MEXICO CITY — Dozens of fishermen have burned a boat as part of a threat to force out a ship operated by the Sea Shepherd Conservation Society in Mexico's Gulf of California.

Sea Shepherd has been removing illegal and abandoned nets that endanger the vaquita, the world's smallest porpoise. Illegal fishing for the totoaba, another species, has reduced the number of vaquitas to fewer than 30.


Fishermen in the town of San Felipe painted the name of the Sea Shepherd on an empty, open fishing boat they burned Sunday. They threatened to remove the conservationists' ship themselves if the government doesn't.

"Just as they are judging us fishermen, we will judge all the environmentalists," said Sunshine Rodriguez, a leader of the local fishing cooperative in San Felipe, Baja California. "We aren't going to just sit around."

A speaker at Sunday's protest — which drew hundreds of onlookers and supporters at San Felipe's main waterfront boulevard— said over a loudspeaker, "I'm giving them (the government) five days to get this boat out of our territorial waters, or we will do it ourselves.

The fishermen were angered by conservationists' calls for a boycott of Mexican shrimp, and possible plans to permanently ban all gillnet fishing in the area. Vaquitas get caught in nets set for the totoaba, a fish prized in China for its swim bladder. The dried bladders can fetch thousands of dollars per kilogram (2.2 pounds).

Oona Layole, the captain of the Sea Shepherd ship, said Monday her vessel is planning to stay despite the threats, but noted "the atmosphere is tense."

"I was expecting to get some reaction from the fishing communities, but it is shocking that these people feel that they can publicly express violent threats to us, such as burning our ships," Layole said.

The situation has already turned violent. In early March, a gang of dozens of fishermen overturned inspectors' trucks and burned or destroyed 15 vehicles and patrol boats, as well as beating three inspectors from the office for environmental protection in another town on the Gulf of California, which is also known as the Sea of Cortez.

Then, on March 16, a coalition of U.S. environmental groups launched a call to boycott Mexican shrimp — one of the country's most lucrative seafood exports — to pressure the government to do more to save the vaquita.

Conservationists are pressing Mexico's government to permanently ban all gillnet fishing in the upper Gulf, the only place in the world the vaquita is found. Partial and temporary bans are already in place.

The Sunday demonstration also featured fishermen holding up banners with the names of prominent conservationists, researchers and scientists, on a list of enemies.

In other parts of the world, Sea Shepherd vessels have rammed whaling ships. But in the Gulf, the group's ship has peacefully patrolled the waters, looking for vaquitas — finding some dead and some alive — and illegal nets, which it removes.

A government official who was not authorized to be quoted by name said Sea Shepherd was working jointly with the government to withdraw nets and report illegal fishing, and said the group had been a valuable ally in the effort. The official said authorities would step up protection for the campaign.

Totoaba fishermen have mainly cut and run when confronted by Mexican Navy patrols in the past, but activists and environmentalists have warned that criminal gangs appear to be involved in the lucrative illegal trade and that threats have been mounting.

Last week the government said poachers are using go-fast boats, and in one case led authorities on 50-mile chase, and parked a pickup truck on a beach to load the boat and try to escape.

Experts and the Mexican government previously announced a plan to catch the few remaining vaquitas and enclose them in pens for protection and possible breeding.

Experts acknowledge the catch-and-enclose plan is risky, because the few remaining females could die during capture, dooming the species.

Still, some experts say the capture program may be the vaquitas' only hope. But others worry that fishermen may engage in a free-for-all once the endangered vaquita is removed and thus wipe out other species in the gulf.
 

jerry

Guest
Jerry did that link have something to do with vaquitas
Yes...a lot of the problems with the golf are due to the lack of Colorado River flow....the fish numbers are down in large part from this man made event
 

Stuart

Aye carumba!!!
Staff member
"Sunshine Rodriguez" Yeah, he sounds like a real ray of Sunshine. Bwhahahaha!

The situation is bound to become more dire. Feed their families? Make the cartels richer? Kill off the last of the vaquita? Cut out those totuaba swim bladders? So, what happens when they are gone? The vaquita gone? The totuaba gone?

The opportunity to rape, pillage and plunder goes away with them. They won't be able to make enough money selling the corvina that might be left and those will quickly disappear as well. And the northern San Felipe/El Golfo area will just become an ocean desert, unless they can open a new market in China for lizardfish. Not like the fishing there has been all that great anyway; I never bother going that far north to fish, even though I have oodles of waypoints up that way. Fishing out of San Felipe is pretty disappointing, too.

I guess it's easy money in the meantime. It's too late for any reasonable eco solutions to work. Like eco boat tours, taking tourists out to see the vaquita, or as I have suggested for many years, issuing a $100 sportfishing stamp for the take of say two sport-caught totuaba with the money funding breeding and restocking programs, or eco system protection. The totuaba have made a pretty amazing comeback. I went many years without ever seeing or catching one. Now, it's not that uncommon to catch one on a trip out by the 22 or even south at the Caballo down by the island. Or even down by Jerry's joint so his stupid buddy captain can catch them and post them on Facebook as "white seabass." What a dolt that guy is!!

But, gill nets will once again wipe out all the big breeders and the population will dwindle as it did in the past. You'd think they might have learned something from the shrimp fishermen. I remember the ruckus, roadblocks, and protests when the govt. mandated a strict shrimp season. "We don't need no stinkin' rules!" Well, ask any of them now whether or not the season has helped improve the catch. It has, the industry itself, which was in tatters, has sustained and recovered quite a bit. A quick trip to the fish market by the malecon proves that point, plenty of good looking shrimp, reasonable prices.

I've also said this a million times. I love Mexico, I don't think there's anyone here that doubts that. But they continue to be their own worst enemy and want to cut their nose off to spite their face. It's sad. Truly sad.
 
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I had a feeling it was coming to this.....

That big blue trouble maker is going to sink at sea or burn while moored at it's home port in San Felipe very soon. Just yesterday I was talking to a guy with a boat from San Felipe while getting my fuel tank drained of water and gas. He has a nice Striper that he launches from the San Felipe marina and sees the Sea Shepherd there regularly. Told me it's just a party boat for young SJW kids that sign on for the "thrill" of "legally screwing" with the local fishermen and that most of the time they are hanging out in town whoopin it up at the bars. He told me that he was surprised that local pangeros hadn't kicked the crap out of any of them yet. I see it out there on our way to and from PP and it's usually anchored or just drifting. I haven't seen the smaller Martin Sheen for more than a year now, musta moved on to better pickins somewhere. Don't ever underestimate the capabilities of the Cartel people as they invented terrorism back in the days of Pablo and his crew, a well placed RPG fired from a panga at the waterline of Old Blue will put an end to their crap in an instant.

I think that the commercial fishing industry will completely crash way before any mass extinction of anything other than the Vaquita occurs. There's a lot of water out there and plenty of places that the nets and bottom scrapers can't get to and being a marine animal means that you must be pretty damned resilient to survive. Unless of course some dumb shit brings live shrimp infected with a shrimp killing virus from Venezuela to the Gila River shrimp farms then takes those shrimp to El Golfo for processing and the heads get tossed into the Sea of Cortez and almost wipe out the Gulf Blues in less than two years time.

JJ
 

Stuart

Aye carumba!!!
Staff member
I think that the commercial fishing industry will completely crash way before any mass extinction of anything other than the Vaquita occurs.

JJ
I tend to disagree. A collapse of the industry is possible, but you know as well as I do that they just shift focus to another species after extincting the current one. Big or small, they will kill them all. You do know why the Chinese want the totuaba bladders, right? And where this magic healing power (or whatever power they supposedly have) came from, right? Ain't like they jumped in a canoe and paddled on over here to the Cortez and discovered them. No, instead they fished every damned one of their own in the Yangtze River basin out of existence. The "bahaba" or giant yellow croaker pretty much the same fish. Catching a single one these days in China can bring close to $500,000; they are so rare as to indeed be considered extinct at this point. And they... haven't... come... back. After killing all of their own, oh wow! Lookee here! They have the same fish in Mexico, let's go get some. In fact, let's go get as many of those bladders as we can. We don't care about the rest of the fish, let it rot on the beach.

The only things that will ultimately save the totuaba from the douchebag Chinese? Well, it ain't Mexicans for sure. It will be a crashing market for the bladders themselves in China, which has already started to happen. Bladders bought on speculation for $100,000 each are now only bringing a few thousand dollars at best. It's a crumbling market and that's a good thing, it reduces the demand. Second, more enforcement. They recently arrested several big shipments of bladders. Throw the Chinese caught in jail and let them rot for poaching.

On extinction of a fish species - google and read about "Orange Roughy" sometime. This occurred mostly off the coast of Chile, not Mexico, but same-same about pretty much extincting an entire species of fish for commercial purposes until it's no longer viable to even try to catch. Being a very deepwater and extremely slow to reproduce fish, yeah, we've eaten nearly all of them at trendy restaurants over the years. Hey, I'm just as guilty. I loved it and would regularly buy it because everybody had it. Never knew anything about it back then, just yum-yum. Thank-god the whole world is waking up and starting to be more conscious of what they eat and where it came from, but I'm sure we'll manage to whack a species here and a species there before all is said and done. And maybe, just maybe... those SJW kids on the big blue ship are actually helping in this effort. Although I don't doubt they party down in San Felipe. What the hell else is there to do? Ain't like it's a cultural mecca!! :rofl:

:shark: :shark: :shark: :shark: :puff2:
 

jerry

Guest
"Sunshine Rodriguez" Yeah, he sounds like a real ray of Sunshine. Bwhahahaha!

The situation is bound to become more dire. Feed their families? Make the cartels richer? Kill off the last of the vaquita? Cut out those totuaba swim bladders? So, what happens when they are gone? The vaquita gone? The totuaba gone?

The opportunity to rape, pillage and plunder goes away with them. They won't be able to make enough money selling the corvina that might be left and those will quickly disappear as well. And the northern San Felipe/El Golfo area will just become an ocean desert, unless they can open a new market in China for lizardfish. Not like the fishing there has been all that great anyway; I never bother going that far north to fish, even though I have oodles of waypoints up that way. Fishing out of San Felipe is pretty disappointing, too.

I guess it's easy money in the meantime. It's too late for any reasonable eco solutions to work. Like eco boat tours, taking tourists out to see the vaquita, or as I have suggested for many years, issuing a $100 sportfishing stamp for the take of say two sport-caught totuaba with the money funding breeding and restocking programs, or eco system protection. The totuaba have made a pretty amazing comeback. I went many years without ever seeing or catching one. Now, it's not that uncommon to catch one on a trip out by the 22 or even south at the Caballo down by the island. Or even down by Jerry's joint so his stupid buddy captain can catch them and post them on Facebook as "white seabass." What a dolt that guy is!!

But, gill nets will once again wipe out all the big breeders and the population will dwindle as it did in the past. You'd think they might have learned something from the shrimp fishermen. I remember the ruckus, roadblocks, and protests when the govt. mandated a strict shrimp season. "We don't need no stinkin' rules!" Well, ask any of them now whether or not the season has helped improve the catch. It has, the industry itself, which was in tatters, has sustained and recovered quite a bit. A quick trip to the fish market by the malecon proves that point, plenty of good looking shrimp, reasonable prices.

I've also said this a million times. I love Mexico, I don't think there's anyone here that doubts that. But they continue to be their own worst enemy and want to cut their nose off to spite their face. It's sad. Truly sad.
Hey my buddy is far from a dolt..a damn retired engineer and the go to guy when no one else could figure shit out at one of the wests biggest firms..your just envious because he's living the dream...early retired,cute blonde running partner and fishing g charter business that is really working.He took 4 groups of kids out to a rock pile a mile off shore one day when I was there...didn't even make gas money just to introduce them to fishing they had a ball!
 
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Oh boy, I liked that one Stu!

I's gonna take me a stiff drink and a couple of hours to respond to that one. Never knew about the ChiCom Yangtze Toto's before now.

Later,

JJ
 

Stuart

Aye carumba!!!
Staff member
Hey my buddy is far from a dolt..a damn retired engineer and the go to guy when no one else could figure shit out at one of the wests biggest firms..your just envious because he's living the dream...early retired,cute blonde running partner and fishing g charter business that is really working.He took 4 groups of kids out to a rock pile a mile off shore one day when I was there...didn't even make gas money just to introduce them to fishing they had a ball!
Jerry, he may be the best guy in the world. But you're still an idjiot if A) you don't know the species of fish you caught or B) you're stupid enough to post illegal fish you caught on social media to promote your fledgling charter business.

And survey says... he did both. Do you NOT see the issue with this? If not, you're part of the problem and need to shut the fuck up because your "save the sea" shit is nothing but hypocrisy.
 

jerry

Guest
Jerry, he may be the best guy in the world. But you're still an idjiot if A) you don't know the species of fish you caught or B) you're stupid enough to post illegal fish you caught on social media to promote your fledgling charter business.

And survey says... he did both. Do you NOT see the issue with this? If not, you're part of the problem and need to shut the fuck up because your "save the sea" shit is nothing but hypocrisy.
Ha,
Jerry, he may be the best guy in the world. But you're still an idjiot if A) you don't know the species of fish you caught or B) you're stupid enough to post illegal fish you caught on social media to promote your fledgling charter business.

And survey says... he did both. Do you NOT see the issue with this? If not, you're part of the problem and need to shut the fuck up because your "save the sea" shit is nothing but hypocrisy.
cranky this morning sitting at the old desk while us beach house owners sit on a lawn chair watching the sun rise over the Cardon Forrest?....no matter,someday you will get out of the rat race too! Anyways he used our excellent forum and figured it out...even came up with an improved rig to send them back to the bottom being a inventive type....The El Golfo mood is a little bit dark but the Sea Sheapards are doing an excellent job.The reality is sometimes you just have to change jobs.Hell think about all those poor narcs in Colorado now forced on the unemployment rolls because of the great hippie victory! They picked themselves up and now are happily reading parking meters somewhere.
 

Kenny

Guest
Jerry, he may be the best guy in the world. But you're still an idjiot if A) you don't know the species of fish you caught or B) you're stupid enough to post illegal fish you caught on social media to promote your fledgling charter business.

And survey says... he did both. Do you NOT see the issue with this? If not, you're part of the problem and need to shut the fuck up because your "save the sea" shit is nothing but hypocrisy.
Rick Hammer did the same thing when he bought the big boat and created his website. I emailed him to ask him why in the hell he had a picture of a T Bass as one of the fish a customer might catch.
 

Stuart

Aye carumba!!!
Staff member
Rick Hammer did the same thing when he bought the big boat and created his website. I emailed him to ask him why in the hell he had a picture of a T Bass as one of the fish a customer might catch.
Wouldn't surprise me. But he aint' "hammering" fish anymore that I'm aware of. And maybe that's a good thing. Again, like Jerry's friend, Rick isn't a bad guy -- not saying he is. Just making some stupid moves in promoting themselves. One of my first pictures published on Gene Kira's website is a 60 lb. totuava we caught and released at the Caballo. I was scared shitless to even have one in my boat back then. I had heard so much about them being protected and all and thought the police would be waiting to slap the cuffs on me if I brought it into the docks and didn't want one anywhere near my boat. Even today, we always release them, although I've seen a few show up at the harbor from time-to-time as incidental catch that died. That, I don't have a huge issue with. They have come back so well sometimes it's hard not to catch one.
 
Hey Stu.............

Anyone could just fillet and skin em on their boat while off shore, like I don't. I don't even like the taste of any members of the Croaker tribe. I almost always toss em back, excepting the monster that I got off of La Cholla two years ago. After giving away more than forty pounds of fillets and cubed steaks I still have at least ten pounds of that big boy in my coo-lero. Also, do you have any current contact info on Gene? The last phone number that I have from him when he moved to New Mexico is no longer in service.

JJ
 

Stuart

Aye carumba!!!
Staff member
Hey Stu.............

Anyone could just fillet and skin em on their boat while off shore, like I don't. I don't even like the taste of any members of the Croaker tribe. I almost always toss em back, excepting the monster that I got off of La Cholla two years ago. After giving away more than forty pounds of fillets and cubed steaks I still have at least ten pounds of that big boy in my coo-lero. Also, do you have any current contact info on Gene? The last phone number that I have from him when he moved to New Mexico is no longer in service.

JJ
Unfortunately, I don't. He and I used to correspond often, but I haven't heard anything from or of him now for quite some time. Man, he wrote the book! The endless hours I would spend reading and planning trips based on the Baja Catch. Addicted me instantly, best fishing "crack" I've ever had. I still break out my old beat up copy of it from time-to-time.
 

jerry

Guest
All is lost.......
Thus, in 11 days the communities of the Gulf of Santa Clara, Sonora and San Felipe , Baja California are able to return to fishing without restrictions, using all types of nets, which would pose a serious risk to the small population of vaquita Marine, species in serious danger of extinction, of which less than 30 copies remain.
Conapesca's decision to withdraw the project was interpreted by Carlos Tirado Pineda, leader of the fishermen of the Gulf of Santa Clara as a triumph of the union before the pressure that exerted so that the federal government allows them to return to the sea.
On March 8, the community of the Gulf of Santa Clara attacked inspectors of the Federal Environmental Protection Agency (Profepa) with rocks and sticks and burned 10 official vans, two boats and three quad cars, in the absence of permits for the capture Of Curvina Golfina.
Jcp
 

mondone

Whitecaps
:(:(
All is lost.......
Thus, in 11 days the communities of the Gulf of Santa Clara, Sonora and San Felipe , Baja California are able to return to fishing without restrictions, using all types of nets, which would pose a serious risk to the small population of vaquita Marine, species in serious danger of extinction, of which less than 30 copies remain.
Conapesca's decision to withdraw the project was interpreted by Carlos Tirado Pineda, leader of the fishermen of the Gulf of Santa Clara as a triumph of the union before the pressure that exerted so that the federal government allows them to return to the sea.
On March 8, the community of the Gulf of Santa Clara attacked inspectors of the Federal Environmental Protection Agency (Profepa) with rocks and sticks and burned 10 official vans, two boats and three quad cars, in the absence of permits for the capture Of Curvina Golfina.
Jcp
 
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